principlesqlMajor

DDL_admin vs db_owner permissions

Submitted by: @import:stackexchange-dba·Mar 10, 2026·

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db_ownerpermissionsddl_admin

Problem

I'm taking over a project that involves removing and limiting permissions of all database users across our server farm. (fun times)

One of the permissions currently being limited is db_owner permissions.

This permission is being reviewed on a case-by-case basis, but a common change is to replace the db_owner permissions with the following:

db_datareader

db_datawriter

db_ddladmin

db_executor

I would like to define the exact difference between the two (to inform clients).

However, as far as I can tell, the difference between the two should be:

db_accessadmin permissions

db_backupoperator permissions

db_securityadmin permissions

So in effect they would lose:

[ALTER ANY USER]

[CREATE SCHEMA]

[BACKUP DATABASE], [BACKUP LOG], [CHECKPOINT]

[ALTER ANY APPLICATION ROLE], [ALTER ANY ROLE]

[DROP DATABASE]

Is there anything else that a user would loose once db_owner is replaced by the four roles above?

Does this actually serve much of a purpose security wise?

Solution

db_ddladmin vs db_owner

From what I can tell from what I tested and read up on, for the most part your list looks accurate except db_ddladmin DOES allow you to CREATE SCHEMA. I did confirm that the other security permissions you listed were indeed denied.

Denied with DDLADMIN only:

[ALTER ANY USER]

[BACKUP DATABASE], [BACKUP LOG], [CHECKPOINT]

[ALTER ANY APPLICATION ROLE], [ALTER ANY ROLE]

[DROP DATABASE]

Noting that the. . .

db_datareader will allow SELECT access to all tables

db_datarwriter will allow INSERT, UPDATE, and DELETE access to all tables

db_executor will allow EXECUTE access to all executable objects

Additonally, having db_ddladmin role permissions may mean. . .

Note: Since you have so many different versions of SQL Server from 2005 - 2014, it may be best to have a small set of users test
this initially to see who screams to iron out any kinks, etc.

-
Objects they own with this role will not be owned by DBO so you may have to deal with ownership chaning issues if there's ever a problem with something at this level. I'm not 100% certain that this would be a problem but it's worth mentioning just in case.

Source: Ownership Chains

-
With this role (may vary depending on the version of SQL Server) they may be able to add SQL security principles defined in the current DB to objects they own still, just not all objects (ones they do not own) nor add a new server-level defined principal to the DB level.

Additionally, not having DBO role permissions may mean. . .

Note: Since you have so many different versions of SQL Server from 2005 - 2014, it may be best to have a small set of users test
this initially to see who screams to iron out any kinks, etc.

-
Not having the DBO role may prevent certain SSMS designer GUI interfaces (SQL Server version varying) from populating or opening without error (e.g. when modifying tables or columns through the GUI) even though doing it via T-SQL works and the permissions are in place. In some versions of SQL Server this may be resolved by allowing GRANT VIEW DEFINITION where this is an issue and it can also just be a warning only on certain versions of SQL Server.

Resources

-
You are not logged in as the database owner or as a user that is a member of the db_owner role. You will not be able to save changes to tables that you do not own.

-
db_ddladmin Role doesn't allow use of "design" functions in SSMS

"We try to prevent giving users/developers dbo in their QA databases
as much as we can. One of the problems with this is that they still
need to be able to create and modify database objects such as user
tables. Many devs are new to MS SQL and thus tend to stick with the
GUI (SSMS) for this sort of work. The problem arises when we grant
them db_ddladmin (not dbo) and they are no longer able to modify
tables or columns via the table designer GUI. Instead, they have to
take additional time to learn the TSQL commands and their syntax (that
they may never need again) or engage the DBA team which takes time
away from our other activities.

I don't know if this is a bug or a feature request but I consider it a
bug since the user has sufficient permissions to alter the table via
TSQL but the GUI gives them messages stating:

"You are not logged on as the database owner or system
administrator. You might not be able to save changes to tables that
you do not own." AND "Table [schema].[table] is set to read only,
user doesn't have enough rights on this table."

A trace seems to point to the check being a is_member('db_owner')
which will preclude members of db_ddladmin even though they do in fact
have permissions to modify the object. Microsoft SQL Server Management
Studio"

Posted by Agent DBA on 1/25/2010 at 7:06 AM

I had a similar issue and managed to solve it by performing the
following grant

GRANT view definition on schema::  to

Other Considerations

Since you state that this is being reviewed on a case-by-case basis

One of the permissions currently being limited is db_owner permissions.

This permission is being reviewed on a case-by-case basis, but a common change is to replace the db_owner permissions with the following:

db_datareader

db_datawriter

db_ddladmin

db_executor

Have you considered creating additional custom roles for more "all object" DB-level access that each person needs rather than granting them the db_ddladmin role as that will probably give them more than they actually need to DB level objects as well.

I usually give what's needed exactly and nothing more for them to do their job and if there's a "usual" or "standard" need for DB level object access to all objects in a DB, I create a custom DB role sort of like the the db_executor but see my below example. This way you can grant the people what they really need to ALL DB object in a particular DB if yo

Code Snippets

GRANT view definition on schema:: <schemaname> to <username>

----Custom Database Roles

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE  -- Execute to all stored procs including newly created ones*/
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_StoredProc_Execute
GRANT EXECUTE TO db_All_StoredProc_Execute

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE  -- Alter to all stored procs including newly created ones*/
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_StoredProc_Alter
GRANT ALTER ANY SCHEMA TO db_All_StoredProc_Alter

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE  -- View Definition to all stored procs including newly created ones*/
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_StoredProc_View
GRANT VIEW DEFINITION TO db_All_StoredProc_View

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE - Any schema alter and create procedure permissions */
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_CreateProc_AlterSchema
GRANT ALTER ANY SCHEMA TO db_All_CreateProc_AlterSchema
GRANT CREATE PROCEDURE TO db_All_CreateProc_AlterSchema
GO

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE - Any schema alter and create table permissions */
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_CreateTable_AlterSchema
GRANT ALTER ANY SCHEMA TO db_All_CreateTable_AlterSchema
GRANT CREATE TABLE TO db_All_CreateTable_AlterSchema

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE - Any schema alter and create function permissions */
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_CreateFunction_AlterSchema
GRANT ALTER ANY SCHEMA TO db_All_CreateFunction_AlterSchema
GRANT CREATE FUNCTION TO db_All_CreateFunction_AlterSchema

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE - Any schema alter and create aggregate permissions */
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_CreateAggregate_AlterSchema
GRANT ALTER ANY SCHEMA TO db_All_CreateAggregate_AlterSchema
GRANT CREATE AGGREGATE TO db_All_CreateAggregate_AlterSchema

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE - Any schema alter and create view permissions */
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_CreateView_AlterSchema
GRANT ALTER ANY SCHEMA TO db_All_CreateView_AlterSchema
GRANT CREATE VIEW TO db_All_CreateView_AlterSchema

/* CREATE A NEW ROLE - Any schema alter and create schema permissions */
-- Database specific
CREATE ROLE db_All_CreateSchema_AlterSchema
GRANT ALTER ANY SCHEMA TO db_All_CreateSchema_AlterSchema
GRANT CREATE SCHEMA TO db_All_CreateSchema_AlterSchema

---Create ddladmin restriction custom DB role
DENY ALTER ANY ASSEMBLY                    TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY ASYMMETRIC KEY              TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY CERTIFICATE                 TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY CONTRACT                    TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY DATABASE DDL TRIGGER        TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY DATABASE EVENT NOTIFICATION TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY DATASPACE                   TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY FULLTEXT CATALOG            TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY MESSAGE TYPE                TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY REMOTE SERVICE BINDING      TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY ROUTE                       TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY SCHEMA                      TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY SERVICE                     TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY ALTER ANY SYMMETRIC KEY               TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CHECKPOINT                            TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE AGGREGATE                      TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE DEFAULT                        TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE FUNCTION                       TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE PROCEDURE                      TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE QUEUE                          TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE RULE                           TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE SYNONYM                        TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE TABLE                          TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE TYPE                           TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE VIEW                           TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY CREATE XML SCHEMA COLLECTION          TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
DENY REFERENCES                            TO db_DDLAdmin_Restriction
GO

Context

StackExchange Database Administrators Q#121208, answer score: 27

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